relationship draw to blow for overbending 5blow
Hello Kinya,
I'm still hard at work on my mule (My trusty marineband is getting better and better).
This is the new situation I have. So I've got 1-2-3-4-5-6 gapped and profiled pretty well. I might do some slight adjustments but overall I'm very happy with them except hole number 5.
So I've gapped all these holes as tight as I can but not so tight that they'll choke when I play chords or with a bit more enthusiasm. And I've set hole 5 the same way as the other but now I'm debating if that was a good idea.
so here's the problem.
1- I like to do the 2/5 octave bend but with the new gapping I struggle to not bend the 5 draw along side the 2 draw ( I can still get it but it's so sensitive)
2- the 5 overblow is still a bit scratchy, it feels like it still needs adjustment.
and here's what I'm thinking I'd do to fix it: I think maybe I could gap 5draw a bit wider so it's not so easy to bend and 5 blow a bit tighter to help with the overblow. But I'm wondering if overblows share the symbiosis relationship between both draw and blow reed same as the drawbends do ?
so TLDR is I want a 5 draw that doesn't bend so easily and a tighter overblow. What are you thoughts ?
p.s: this harp is now my favorite harp. It plays so perfectly it's impossible to compare to a stock experience.
Regards,
Chris
oh that's an interesting idea, I'll try it as soon as I get home tonight. I'll also take pictures and give you mesurements from the filler guages.
Yesterday I finished holes 7-8-9-10.
Fun fact 7 overblow is basically 7 draw. Even more fun fact, that might sound useless but it's actually not!!!! you can overblow into the natural note giving it a dip quality which adds expression. And 7 overblow is EXTREMELY easy to do technique wise!
(gonna start tuning tonight haha I can't wait. This harp is getting so freaking cool ! This is all thanks to you and your lessons Kinya. Thanks a lot !)
Alright I'm home,
Yes and no. So not easily. I've tried on 4-5-6-7 and I can get them all to overblow with the finger. 5 and curiously 6 are the hardest to get. I needed to breathe harder a bit.
Keep in mind, you're asking a tongue blocker to pucker lol (face already hurts from the unusual position lol). And my marine band reedplates is only secured with 3 screws in the back when the cover plates are off which causes leackage between the holes ( I could hear other reeds play ever so softly lol).
Put it back together and yeppers. 5 overblow needs work. there's even a hint of squeal in there now.
I watched an interview with joe spiel (I hope I didn't murder his name ) and he mentions that when you tune a harp, let it sit a few days and re check. Apparently time alone can have an influence on tuning. So I'm thinking reed gapping might also suffer from this even if very slightly. Or maybe after you play it a while the spring tries to go back to it's original position just a tad. I dono but I think you're onto the right idea, I'll have a look at the whole reed profile.
okay, looking at my notes here I've got 5 blow and draw @ 0.0025 in so if I compare with 4 blow at .002+ and 6 blow at 0.0015 I think maybe it has a bit of room to get tighter.
Far as the bend is concerned I've gotten used to how sensitive it is and it's much better now. Not to mention I just checked and 5 draw is at -29 cents which compared to the normal crossover 5 draw at 0 cents. So I suspect I wasn't actually bending but my ear was telling my brain "dude! you're bending it, your mouth is wrong!"
I luv it Chris that your digesting the techniques at such a voracious clip!
Joe Spier is spot on, anything we do to the reed will impact the tuning. As I wrote on the zero point article, dropping the reed height on the rivet end to establish the zero point will flatten the tuning significantly. Master Harp Tech Joe Filisko allows his work to settle a minimum of one week, before he ships his harmonicas to the customer.
Your Harpsmith, Kinya
Awesome, I'll report back here and there as my project develops.
I've rechecked my 5 draw/blow and the reed's profile was honestly pretty good. light from one end to the other and closes all at once. The only imperfection is that viewed from upside down when the reed is closed into the slot there's a silver of light in the very corner of the zero point. It's however so very small and I now know from experience what it takes to go in and reshape that so I figured I'll leave that alone ( for now at least) lol.
I just gapped it down a bit. So right now it's .002- and that seems a bit better. I'll test drive it like that for a bit and see.
Now all I need to do is tune it. 5 draw is already at -29 so I guess I'll just go 7 limit ;P
It appears your interest in (harmonica) music is more contemporary, favoring chromatic notes, rather than traditional blues chords. If that is the case, I would advise you to tune your instrument to Compromised Just.
This means that 5 draw should be in the -5 to -12 range
Your Harpsmith, Kinya
Actually, no, not at all haha. I understand this post might lead you to think that, though.
While I might have a passing interest in a jazz song here and there and I certainly steal some licks from jazz songs I like. I'm 99.99% a blues player. I'm just doing this to learn and to be able to mostly do all that I need to my own instruments. Most quality customizers have wait lists that go into months (if they take customers at all).
The overblows are a happy accident that just happened and I rolled with it. What I'm really exited about with the overblows is on the 4 (I think?? maybe 5) overblow I've seen Adam Gussow play a lick that I found very interesting so I want to explore that and I really like 7OB sliding into blow 7! That one I want to start using right away and see if I can blues stuff up with it. My main goal is responsive and chordal play. I would 100% never sacrifice response for overblow. ( for the record I can overblow some stock harps too it's just nowhere near this clean. )
This harp is prototype 1. I've set holes 1-6 this way and drove it like that for a week and then 7-10 and it's been another week. (it's a key of A so it's my daily driver harp). Honestly, I expected I would end up chocking reeds... but I didn't ... not even once and I know there were times where I've zoned out and played more aggressively. I can jam blow 1-5-6 but I have to try and it's in not really representative of how I play.
All that's left to try is in a jam session (another place for overblows as we don't always do blues). If I don't choke the reeds while Jamming I'm calling this gapping/profiling a success and I might start my second prototype which will be about straightening/sanding reedplates, embossing and I've got some pretty Frankenstein ideas for the next reed work I want to try haha ;P .
Bravo Chris. All of us will be waiting with bated breath to learn of your progress.
Your Harpsmith, Kinya
haha awesome ;P.
Dont hold your breath though, I suffer from the Fillisko syndrome and only work on my harps when I feel like it so sometimes my projects are patiently waiting, dissassembled, in a box for me to get the mojo again.
If all goes perfectly, prototype 2 might end up being the harp I send you for review ;P
Copy that Chris. Looking forward to that day!
Your Harpsmith, Kinya
Hi Chris, you queried;
Q1: But I'm wondering if overblows share the symbiosis relationship between both draw and blow reed same as the drawbends do ?
A1: Definitely
Depending on the harmonica key, I found reed slot sizing and setting the correct "zero point" on the 5 Blow very important. How does your look? Try this test, with the cover plates removed; can you blow into the 5 blow, then quickly place your finger over the vibrating 5 blow reed... did the 5 draw reed take over? Be mindful of your breath pressure.
https://www.bluesharmonica.com/zero_point_tip_of_the_year
Your Harpsmith, Kinya